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Post by ellipsis on Jan 2, 2011 18:18:39 GMT -5
In theory any duel involving Succat will have lots of para in it, so I'd just look at his games and see what people who beat him do. Of course, occasionally the answer will be that they also parachain, but you can probably find some surprising moves. For instance, it took me a while to realize that sometimes you actually want your opponent to hit you with paralysis this turn, because that "locks in" which hand he can paralyze and he won't be able to paralyze your other hand on the next turn, when you need it. In other words, you need to think holistically about the effects of your choices.
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Post by ourjake on Jan 4, 2011 9:30:25 GMT -5
funny weave that popped up in a game (vs. parachain): after a charm monster to get to DD/XD with no para, if you go DW/DW you get a counter and then blindness or para: DWFFD/DWPPD, and if you go para and cancel on the first 50/50 then you have remove enchantment for cover for three turns (self-para on W to get PDWPP). just something for variety, useful after a try at double charm. or it may be worth the hit to spell flow on the non-charm hand to get them off balance.
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Post by succat on Jan 4, 2011 11:49:34 GMT -5
I might be different in that I will almost always (and happily) accept the Blindness. As long as I can paralyze the person when I'm going into the blindness then it's usually pretty easy to guess their moves, and more than likely I'll be creating an ogre that they won't be able to counter.
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Post by ourjake on Jan 5, 2011 9:11:23 GMT -5
yeah, but WFP is just a counter that costs two life I don't usually like to take a blindness, it feels like it's stronger than invis, even though most people say it isn't. but honestly i think it's because invis feels like they get something and blindness feels like they take something from you
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utis
Ronin Warlock
longing to see were it but the smoke leaping up from his land
Posts: 29
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Post by utis on Jan 5, 2011 10:57:10 GMT -5
Some questions about game mechanics again ...
What has bitten me recently, was a situation like this:
My opponent has a parachain going; my hands:
t1234 PPPxx WWSPP
On turns t to t+1, my left hand was paralysed to P. On turn t+2 I cast counter spell on myself, while my opponent continued to cast paralysis on me (which, in this turn, did have no effect). Now, my expectation was, that, since he continued his parachain on the same target, me, it was necessarily my left hand that was to be paralysed again. Instead, after the counter, he was allowed to re-choose which hand to paralyse -- which was, to my dismay, my right hand.
But then, earlier in the same duel, the following situation -- parachain against me, again; my hand:
t123 xxxx PSDD
My opponent (succat) cast paralysis in turn t+3 at nobody. I assumed at that time, because I was to counter paralysis by casting charm monster on myself at any rate, he did this so he could re-choose which hand to paralyse on turn t+4.
Now, if the paralyser is allowed to re-choose whenever paralysis was not *successful*, this assumption was clearly wrong. I'm aware that an experienced player most probably plays leisurely and possibly even experimentally against a complete newbie in a VF, so I'm hesitant to draw any conclusions. (Thanks, ellipsis, I shall definitely look at succat's matches in the archive.) But is it wrong? By now, I wouldn't be too surprised if the paralyser was allowed to re-choose, if paralysis was countered with a counter spell, but not if countered with a mind spell .... If this is the case, it is an important distinction.
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Post by hermit on Jan 5, 2011 13:12:21 GMT -5
The paralyser is only 'forced' to keep the same hand if the previous turns para-spell was successful. In the case of Succat -vs- you, if he had aimed the para at you in t+3 and you blocked it by charming yourself, he is still allowed to choose the hand for his next successful para.
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Post by xade on Jan 6, 2011 2:19:57 GMT -5
I find blindness is weaker than invis cause you can still be hit by monsters.
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Post by ourjake on Jan 6, 2011 11:19:48 GMT -5
but if it's a big monster and you're trying to break out of a parachain, that weave gives you two shields and a 50/50 blindness/insta-kill on the monster.
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utis
Ronin Warlock
longing to see were it but the smoke leaping up from his land
Posts: 29
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Post by utis on Jan 7, 2011 5:00:01 GMT -5
Another thing -- ellipsis mentioned something about non-default targets. Suposse, I'm harassed by a goblin and I have
PS xS
when I'm hit with paralysis. Suppose, I want to continue either LH:PSFW or RH:SPFP, depending on which hand is paralysed. But I also want to cast either possible magic missile at the goblin. Can I do that?
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Post by mikeEB on Jan 7, 2011 10:37:03 GMT -5
Another thing -- ellipsis mentioned something about non-default targets. Suposse, I'm harassed by a goblin and I have PS xS when I'm hit with paralysis. Suppose, I want to continue either LH:PSFW or RH:SPFP, depending on which hand is paralysed. But I also want to cast either possible magic missile at the goblin. Can I do that? Halfway; You can input F/P and aim your PS hand at the goblin, or you can input F/P and aim your xS hand at the goblin. If you guess which hand is paralyzed and aim that hand at the goblin and the other hand at the default target, you hit the goblin with a missile. If you guess wrong, you hit your opponent with the missile. Aiming both hands is worse than just aiming RH because you might accidentally shield the goblin from your own missile, which also results in an extra goblin hit.
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Post by ellipsis on Jan 8, 2011 5:39:41 GMT -5
In the match with Succat, if your PSD hand was the one paralyzed, then I imagine he aimed para at nobody just out of habit. He would have been able to choose which hand to paralyze on the next turn either way.
And yeah, when you target while under the effect of a mindspell then whatever spell you actually gesture gets cast at whichever target you specify, so when you're trying to gesture PSF, but you're paralyzed, you might as well aim the "F" at whatever you'd like to missile, because if it does become a missile you get to aim it, and if he paralyzes your other hand, then gesturing "PSF" at a goblin doesn't do anything, so you haven't lost anything.
Also, it's worth noting that the assymetry of invis and blindness regarding monsters works the other way, too - when your opponent is blind, he can't target your monsters, but he can if you're invisible. Invisibility is usually better, and it has more weavability, but there are circumstances where blindness would be better.
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Post by ourjake on Jan 10, 2011 19:33:22 GMT -5
i think the reason he para'd nobody was because if you had targetted nobody on PSDD and he para's you then he stays locked into that hand, which can sometimes make the paralyser eat an antispell or some other nastiness if they can't switch hands fast enough (it takes two turns to switch). i.e: PSDDDD/XXSPFP (which comes up decently often in para vs double charm)
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