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Post by succat on Jun 3, 2009 14:15:38 GMT -5
Why Retire? With the rise of Bio and all, it has made me wonder about some of the past 'Greats' of Warlocks. What happened to them? Did they just simply reach their peaks and figured they had nothing left to prove, and so retired? Or did they finally become bored of the game? Or is it a combination of both those things and/or something else I am not seeing? It doesn't seem to me like this is the kind of game you can simply walk away from considering the amount of time and energy put into building up your Elo and/or ladder to a very high point. I have been playing Warlocks for close to 2 years now, and I think it's almost just as fun now as when I started playing it. Of course, there are times when it can get more or less fun depending on how I'm playing and what other real-life-things are going on that can affect the mental state. But, something about this game is very addicting. So back to my original question, why retire? I want to know the real reason, and I don't want to hear the, "I'm too busy now" b.s. We all know that if something is important enough to us, we'll make time for it somehow. And it's not like this game is so complex that it takes months on a white board to analyze your next move. Bio has proven that. For those Old masters that occasionally write in-depth strategy on here, why still talk about strategy, but not utilize it? Do you have nothing left to prove, or are you worried that if you came back now you'd play so horribly at first that it would devalue all of your talk about strategy? Do you think you've risen to the level of a 'coach' now, and that you're somehow beyond the rest of us 'players'? I'm sure I'm wrong, but I'm guessing... My paraholic mind can't fathom it, enlighten me please  |
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Post by BioLogIn on Jun 3, 2009 15:01:54 GMT -5
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Post by succat on Jun 3, 2009 15:50:48 GMT -5
OK, so apparently this thread is a rehash of one that Toyotami started about 2 years ago. I didn't see that one...
What Tali said there makes the most sense to me. He was head and shoulders above everyone else at that time and had nothing left to prove basically.
As for what Slarty said, yeah, I understand how work can drain the life out of you. Still, I don't think this game requires weeks to analyze one move like ExDeath was saying. If you have to spend more than an hour on one move, that just sounds ridiculous to me, and I can't imagine spending more than 30 minutes on a move, but apparently some warlocks do. Seems to me that with all of the experience and past analysis of the game, and all of the in-depth strategy that is discussed from time to time, it would be a simple matter to keep playing warlocks, and play at a very high level.
My analysis of the game has gotten quicker over time, not longer. I play like Toyotami - fast, and without too much meditation. I know I still have lots of improving to do, but over-thinking games has not been helpful to me.
Most of all, I guess, the game is still fun to me, and I suppose once it got to the point where the game wasn't fun anymore, then I'd retire. But for no other reason. Being too busy just sounds like a cop-out, though, and I don't fully buy that one. We're not talking chess here!
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Post by BioLogIn on Jun 3, 2009 15:53:19 GMT -5
Quoted for truth.
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Post by succat on Jun 3, 2009 16:00:10 GMT -5
What, do you think I'm lying to you, Spire Man ?!  |
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Post by ellipsis on Jun 3, 2009 23:59:25 GMT -5
Well I'm nowhere near retirement myself, but I know I've eventually stopped playing every other game I've been obsessed with, and I imagine at some point I'll stop playing warlocks.
What seems most likely to me is that "taking a break" for a couple months leads to getting used to not playing warlocks anymore, and then it feel like an effort to jump back in.
Perhaps.
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Post by xade on Jun 4, 2009 1:41:20 GMT -5
I know that at the moment, I'm in a down phase. I'm working stupid hour days and until my current project is done, I simply don't have the mental fortitude to front up to the circle for 20 odd games at a time. But, this game is awesome, so I'm sure that sooner or later I'll flood the challenge board with new challenges... |
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Post by Dubber on Jun 4, 2009 8:06:34 GMT -5
Once one steps away from Warlocks for a while, the former ease of play is gone and takes some serious effort to regain. I was low 1900s for a while and went away - after couple hundred games since returning, I remain a low 1700's player. Why? Probably because I remember the glory days and how easy it was for a while to know what the opponent was going to do and be right ~80% of the time... now I think I know and am usually wrong. I'm not coding anymore so my mental rigor is lacking and I just play for fun and 3000 games |
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Post by BioLogIn on Jun 5, 2009 2:16:05 GMT -5
Well, yesterday I tried playing 'to have some rest' instead of working on some site like I should have. But because I was really exhausted and sleepy, I made a number of stupidest things, including losing a league game to dumb judgment calls, stabbing into WWP shield in another league game, and casting SWD at amnesia'd PSD player.
Things like this happen to most of us from time to time, but the better you play overall, the more stress you get after this.
What I'm trying to say is that while serious warlocks play is still very enjoyable for me, and while I play reasonably fast (mostly thanks to those who published studies on theory), I still have to invest enough mental+time resources, which it is hardly a thing I can do 'in the background'. Thus I can imagine a situation when investment/fun ratio is not acceptable for me (Taliesin's situation) or when I won't have spare resources to invest (Slarty's).
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Post by Dubber on Jun 5, 2009 8:25:06 GMT -5
...I just play for fun and 3000 games oh, and the hope that I can win 2000 before I play 4000... |
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Post by succat on Jun 5, 2009 19:04:02 GMT -5
Nice comments everyone! I think I'm getting the idea.  As you may have guessed, my secret plot here was to try to coax a few Old Masters out of retirement, and hopefully rile them up enough to make them want to come back and play for all of our entertainment. This probably wont happen, though, unless a couple of them have already come back in the form of younger warlocks in the 1500's, slipping in undetected amongst our ranks in shadowed hoodies. Naw, who am I fooling. It'll never happen. The current Master is unbeatable when he makes sure to visit his nightmares every night. The Old Masters don't want any part of this!  |
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Post by ExDeath on Jun 10, 2009 8:53:46 GMT -5
For me, it is because as a matter of pride, I could not allow myself to play this or any game "casually", i.e. not to the best of my ability. Even if it were true (and I am not suggesting that it is, but it may or may not be) that I could beat BioLogIn consistently while spending only 30 minutes per move as most players do, I would still not want to return unless I could properly challenge myself to find the best move, the truth in every position, almost all of the time.
For me, the competition comes from within myself. I don't care primarily about beating Taliesin's record, or beating whoever is dominant at the time. The most important thing is that I can devote enough time to be the best that _I_ can be. That is why, when my time is limited, I find it more rewarding to advance the study and knowledge of the game by producing analysis than playing actual games where my potential is not being maximized. This is mistaken, by you, as a copout to protect my rating, but to me, the rating is proof of what I have accomplished at my best, irregardless of anyone else's accomplishments before or since, and I would not tarnish it with games that are substandard.
As a side note, it's a shame that the game's inactivity has taken a downturn, but I guess it was only a matter of time since the theorists have gone to sleep and the discussion has become mundane. The best thing anyone could do at this point is to revitalize the game with entirely new variants (a third hand, balanced "class" spellbooks, etc.) which I would gladly give some of my time to if we could assemble a team with the initiative.
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Post by succat on Jun 11, 2009 13:04:50 GMT -5
Here's a possible reason someone might retire...
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Post by xade on Jun 11, 2009 18:42:46 GMT -5
Best inter-jibe ever. |
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Post by BioLogIn on Aug 9, 2010 6:51:09 GMT -5
Recently I was strangely lured by this idea =\ I came to realize that to me warlocks are a (nearly perfect to my tastes) competitive environment. But what to compete for? Gimme the target, fellas =( It is really hard not to go half-ass in my games otherwise =(
Someone, beat me to the ground please =) Or maybe some lurking Master wants to give it a try and shake the rust off? There'll be fun times, I promise ))
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